出生于塞尔维亚的 Lag 是本土地下文化的推动者、DJ 和备受尊敬的制作人，如今他正站在 techno 艺术家新一波浪潮的前沿传递着其深厚的愿景。从小生长于巴尔干地区，动荡的成长经历构建了他独特的表达方式，最终选择电子音乐作为他创作的渠道。虽然你能在 Lag 的作品中听到强烈的朋克与古典音乐教育影响，但最引人注目的还是他充满律动的 techno 及坚定的态度。Lag 因制作而声名大噪后，他的混音以及在各个唱片公司所发行的迥异曲目亦展现了他能力的多样性。
Lag 的 DJ 现场始终不遗余力地证明着自己通过声音吸引人群的能力，展现着他如何带领人群踏上一段完整的旅程：在经过专业的训练和长时间的演出之后，他不断通过作品推广电子音乐文化，Lag 的努力和天赋使他很快从走向世界版图，一跃成为塞尔维亚的 techno 大使，也传递着这位经历过战争与混乱的人的心之所向 —— 包容与团结。
Lag 将继续前行，因为他的使命与愿景还未消逝，他的决心令人敬畏，这也是与音乐才华一同令他不断上升的主要原因。Lag 值得被关注，同样值得被聆听。在他来到 POTENT 之前，先跟随杂志 Playful 一同了解他如何看待 DJ、城市与音乐之间的链接、以及其内心的故事。
Playful：首先，2023 你过得如何？
First of all, how’s 2023 treating you?
Lag: 2023 年很棒，我刚刚在 Berghain 和波兰进行了两场演出，还有一轮美国巡演。已经迫不及待想玩我买的新器材以及那些我还没有探索过的设备。我很高兴能够回归音乐制作和演出，并教会给那些渴望学习的人制作与 DJ 知识。
It’s great on all frontiers. Just played Berghain and two gigs in Poland, and fresh back from a US tour. Can’t wait to play with some new pedals I bought and get more familiar with my gear I didn’t get to explore while I worked in a startup. I'm just really happy to be back to full-time music-making and playing, as well as teaching production and DJing to those hungry to improve.
不幸的是，当时我不得不在某个时间点改变我的生活轨迹，因为疫情发生了，然后我接种了一种欧洲的功能性疫苗，但因为某种原因使我暂时无法旅行（虽然进行了 PCR，但我不是欧盟公民）。当时唯一的希望是，被迫的乡村生活与从事一份要求很高的日常工作只会让我更渴望音乐工作与旅行。多年来，它已经逐渐成为我自然节奏的一部分，并成为我平静和灵感的源泉，我很幸运也很高兴现在能将它重拾。
Unfortunately, I had to change my life’s course for a while there because covid happened and then I got a functional, but according to the EU "wrong" vaccine which made it impossible for me to travel for a while (even with PCRs, as I'm not a EU citizen). The silver lining is that being forced into having a demanding dayjob and being country-locked only made me appreciate working with music and travelling that much more. It has, over the years, crept up to becoming a part of my natural rhythm and source of peace and inspiration and I am lucky and happy to now have it back.
今年是充满感恩的一年，我很高兴回到真正的自己。
This year has been one of gratefulness and I am so happy coming back to who I really am.
Playful：你会如何比较贝尔格莱德和柏林？
How would you compare Beograd and Berlin?
Lag：这两座城市的速度和对新事物的渴望非常相似，贝尔格莱德略显得更为粗糙和无情，也因此诞生了一种仅存于该城市的特殊文化，而柏林作为多元文化中心，提供了更为多样性的选择，如果你在艺术及各方面与贝尔格莱德拥有相似的内在，那么这就是一个很好的地方，如果你不容易适应环境，可能很难会有家的感觉。就像柏林每周都会提供火辣与新鲜的东西，但我在贝尔格莱德最后看到的令我真正感兴趣的事情是 2016 年 Squarepusher 的演出。
The cities are very similar in their speed and hunger for the new. I think Beograd is a bit rougher and unforgiving, producing a special breed of culture only found there, whereas Berlin, being the multi-cultural hub it is, offers a wider variety and choice. If you align artistically (and in other ways) with what Beograd is about - it's a very good place to be. If you are a misfit though, it can be difficult to feel at home. For example, while Berlin offers the extra spicy and quirky on a weekly basis, the last thing I saw in Beograd that really was up my alley was a Squarepusher concert in 2016.
另一个角度而言，我觉得柏林的人们在某些方面认为他们所拥有的一切都是理所当然的。贝尔格莱德的 clubbers 就像大部分斯拉夫人一样，世代都认为没有明天。历史在某些方面塑造了我们的思维方式，认真感受“当下”，而非考虑未来我们可能要付出的代价便是其带来的影响之一。每当我的斯拉夫家人们演出时，我都会感到无比兴奋。我们的派对真的很 hard，到处都是微笑。
On the flipside, I feel like Berlin people seem to take what they have for granted in certain ways. The Beograd clubbers, like so many Slavic people, have embraced throughout generations that there isn't a tomorrow. Centuries of slavery, frequent wars, and decades of living through a deeply corrupt communist system built up our mindset in certain ways, one of which is to deeply appreciate the "now" with no regards for the price our future selves might have to pay for it. I feel a special excitement and giddiness whenever I get to play for my Slavic brothers and sisters! We party really fucking hard, big grins all around.
Clique Of One EP (Don't)；POH007 - Origins EP
Playful：你能描述一下制作新曲目时的创作过程吗？您有什么特别的方法吗？
Can you describe your creative process when producing new tracks? Do you have any particular methods that you use?
Lag：我会花 50% 的时间来制作，然后用 40% 的时间试错以使其更具音乐性与人性化：将声音从网格中删除，在声音的打破与解构中添加一些微妙的不可预测性。人类的大脑是有着多样创意的探索机器，在反复的比对中处理、伸展并丰富曲目的生命力。
I’ll spend 50% of my time just making the track, and then 40% of the time making “mistakes” on purpose to make it more human and musical: putting sounds off the grid, adding nuanced unpredictability across the track, carefully destroying and deconstructiong sounds in musical ways etc. The human brain is a pattern seeking machine so creating variability and contrasts gives it more to deal with, elongating and enriching the life of a track.
最后 10% 的时间，我花在了那些没有人能够真正听到的内容上，并做出一些很可能会毁掉一首完美曲目的决定，因为我不知该在何时停止。从舞池的反应来看，这种方式似乎是成功的。:)
The last 10% I spend fussing about things that no one really hears and possibly making decisions which ruin a perfectly good track because I don’t know when to stop. It does seem to work out in the end, judging by the reactions on the dancefloor. :)
我始终执着的是它是否能够让人群起舞，以及它是否是还未被提及一百万次的东西。这是我多年以来的行为方式，尽管我最近也开始享受通过加强规范来限制自己，并尝试自己能否打破限制。从而导向一些有趣的结果，这也是最重要的 —— hella fun。
The only thing I am cosnsitently obsessed with is whether it's dancable and whether it's something that hasn't been said a million times already. That has been my MO for many years, although recently I've started also enjoying limiting myself by imposing what is the norm and trying to see if I can distrupt within those confines. Very interesting results and, more imporetantly - hella fun.
Playful：Berghain 对你来说意味着什么？
What does Berghain mean to you?
Lag：Berghain 是边缘群体的避风港，吸引着 “too weird to live, too rare to die (太过怪异而不能生存，太过珍贵而不能灭亡)”的人群。
Berghain is a safe-haven for misfits, a magnet for the “too weird to live, too rare to die”.
我可以在那里做自己而不被评价。尤其在音乐方面，多年来，我一直听说在那里演出“不同”的声音是多么的不可原谅，但我发现事实并非如此，如果你尊重人群，ta 们总是非常乐于聆听。就像我上次在那演出，我感觉破碎的节拍可能不适合当时的人群，但并不意味着我不能插入 Ples Slovena 的音乐，一旦我获得了足够的信任你便能看到它的腾飞。同样，上次在 Berghain，我发现舞池的能量需要更多的 peak-time 选曲，但在当时的 set 中插入 Darkside - Ecdysis! 似乎是正确的选择，当我播放后，气氛也并未因此下沉。拥有这样一个可以表达自我的地方真的太自由了，我无法将它与其他任何地方进行比较。
I can be myself there and not feel judged. Especially musically. Throughout the years I kept hearing how unforgivable it is to play “different” stuff in there but I found that to very much not the case. If you are respectful towards the crowd they are always more than happy to indulge you and hear what you have to say. For example, this last time I played I just felt like the mood was such that broken stuff would not be that perfect of a fit for who I was having the conversation with, which didn’t mean I couldn’t slip in Ples Slovena and see it take off once I've earned enough trust and "credit". Similarly, the previous time I played Berghain the slot and the energy of the room demanded more of a peak-time selection, but playing Darkside - Ecdysis! in the middle of the set seemed like the right choice at the time and it didn't clear the room. To the contrary. It's so liberating to have a such a place where you can express yourself and I can't really compare it to anywhere else.
除此之外，我在 Berghain 遇到的每个工作人员都非常谦虚与勤奋。在那个地方我感受不到一点个人主义。它就像一个珍奇异兽，感受着自身的美妙与力量，但同样明白其中微妙的生态系统对于每个参与者而言是如此珍贵且有意义。这里蕴含着大量的汗水与爱的投入，我很荣幸我能用自己的方式为此做出贡献。
Additionally, everyone who I've met that works in Berghain is extremely humble and hardworking. I don’t feel an ounce of ego throughout that place. It's a very rare beast, aware of its own beauty and power, but also understanding how delicate this ecosystem within it is, how precious and meaningful it is to everyone involved. There is a lot of sweat and wisely invested love in there and I couldn’t be more grateful that I get to contribute to it in my own way.
Playful：与其他演出相比，你是如何准备 Berghain 的 set？其中有什么区别吗？
How do you prepare for a Berghain set compared to any other set? Is there any difference?
Lag：没有任何区别。我需要的只有我的词汇量（即音乐收藏），以及我将词汇连成句子的方式（即 DJ 技艺）。要说些什么便取决于聆听对话的另一方，即舞池。
There is absolutely no difference. All I need is my vocabulary (ie. music collection), and my way of connecting the words into sentences (ie. skills in the craft/art of DJing). What will be said depends on listening to the other side of the dialogue which is the dancefloor.
在 PLUR 的语境与 DJ 艺术中 —— 过于详尽的准备工作或怀揣一些固有想法的 DJ 在演出时想表达的仅仅是自我，也因此忽视了那些站在 DJ 台另一端为夜晚带来生机的人群。这种关于 DJ 想法有点过于挑剔，但最近我看到了我心中的偶像之一 Laurent Garnier 的采访，他在其中表达了完全一致的观点，所以我会继续努力传递它。
In the context of PLUR and the art of DJing - too specific of a preparation or holding on to very fixed ideas on what a DJ will be saying during their set is just ego, as well as disregard for those who pay the ticket to be on the other side of the DJ booth and who, that way, give life to the night. I thought myself too judgy when it comes to holding this view of DJing but recently saw an interview of one of my all-time-heroes Laurent Garnier where he stated a completely identical view so I'll keep trying to pass it on.
无论是在 Berghain 还是本土的小型演出，我在演出前总是会有点紧张。这感觉就像第一次约会——遇到一个全新的人，ta可能会成为你一生的朋友。对于 DJ 来说，最大的回报就在于我们共同对音乐的热爱、期待、探索与认可。
I always get a bit nervous before playing, whether it's Berghain or a small local gig. It feels like a first date - like meeting an entirely new person that could be your friend for life. In that anticipation, exploration, and recognition of our joint love for music lies the greatest reward when it comes to DJing.
Playful：你如何看待 techno 未来的发展？你音乐中的哪部分适合这片图景？
How do you see the future of techno music evolving, and where do you see your own music fitting into this landscape?
Lag: 这对我来说是一个非常困难的问题。2019年我的热情有点燃烧殆尽，持续了几年才缓解过来，一度让我误入歧途。我没有专注于我喜欢同时也与工作相连的 techno，而是转向了其他流派。当我回过神来我无法看清这个场景与其中的声音。
Oh, this is a very difficult question for me. My burnout, which started in 2019. and kept going for a few years before I slowed down, led me astray for a while. Rather than focus on techno, which I love but also associate with work, my soul went to other genres. When I came back to it I couldn't really recognize the scene and its sound.
Makaton - Defiler (Lag Remix)
直到现在我才慢慢再次集中注意力，不得不说目前与之相关的场景确实很难真正弄清。有段时间我很担心这个问题。缺乏理解让我感到恐慌，因为我依靠 techno 生活，而要做到这一点，我必须了解什么是已被遗弃的，什么是正确的。最近我允许自己不那么注意这一切，所有的焦虑都消失了。最后，记住这些就变得解放了：1. 像往常一样，我只演奏我相信的音乐。2. 不确定什么适合我让我有更多自由去创作我想要的东西。为了解释我的观点，我刚刚自发行了一首拥有工业声响的混音 [Makaton - Defiler (Lag Remix)] ，这是我最喜欢的曲目之一。同时我正在和我一位当地朋友制作一些快乐简单的 ghetto-tech，也和 X-Coast 一起制作更多纯粹、有趣的 old-school techno。去年我发行了五张唱片，每一张都各不相同，基本上与我现在制作的声音毫无关系。但它们在俱乐部的反响都很好，这才是最重要的，真的。
I’m only now slowly getting the focus sharpened again and I have to say that I do have trouble really figuring out the current constellation. For a while I was really anxious about this. Lack of understanding made me feel panicky because I am supposed to live off of techno, and to do so I have to understand what's left and what's right. Recently I gave myself permission to not care and all the anxiousness went away. In the end it became liberating to remember that 1. as always, I will just play the music I believe in and 2. not knowing what fits gives me more liberty to make whatever the hell I want. To illustrate my point, I just self-released a very industrial-sounding remix of a favorite track of mine. At the same time I’m making some happy, simple ghetto-tech with a local friend of mine, as well as doing more pure-fun old-school techno with X-Coast. Last year I released five records, all different from each other and basically nothing to do with the stuff I'm making right now. People react equally well to all of these when played in the club, and this is all that matters, really.
关于眼下的场景…如果人群对我不太理解的音乐反响很好，那也很自然。我真的希望有一天能感受并与他们分享快乐。有时我们忽视了新想法的卖点，因为我们习惯于以前的价值观，但这些价值观可能只在早已消失的背景下有意义。我唯一能直言不讳、并希望看到改变或者回归的就是“律动”。来吧，把节奏带回来！这是电子舞曲，而不是僵硬的声音。给我一些让我可以舞动的东西！
Regarding the scene and where it is right now... If people react well to the music I don't really understand - then so be it. I do really hope to get it some day and share their joy. Sometimes we are blind to the selling point of the new direction because we cling too close to some previous values, but those are values which made sense in a context that might be long gone. The only thing I really am vocal about and that I wish to see change or, well, come back is groove. I mean, come on - bring the groove back! It's electronic dance music, not electronic stiff music. Gimme something I can wiggle to!
Playful：你想向观众传达的最重要的内容是什么？
What is the most important thing for you to deliver to an audience?
Lag: Techno 是缤纷的，并不仅是黑色的。每一种情绪都是合理的，没有任何一件事是我们不存在于夜晚，不允许被谈论的。
Techno is all colors, not only black. Every emotion is valid, and there really is no one thing we should not include and "talk about" during the night.
况且，为了所有人而存在的东西，往往并不为任何人存在。
Also, whatever is for everyone is for no one.
最后，我所探寻的是致力于舞池的声音于独特个人风格之间的平衡，这可能不会让大部分人群惊叹，但会给舞池带来一种于灵魂结合的声音记忆。一个 wink 或是击掌，都展现着人们所理解的灵魂瞬间，这意味着他们并不孤单。我认为这确实是音乐最伟大的力量。
In the end, what I hunt for is the balance between dancefloor pleasers versus the peculiar, individualistic flavors which might not wow most of the room, but will gift some dancers it connects to a soul-binding sonic memory. A wink and a hi-five, showing a few souls that someone does understand, and that not only are they not alone, but that the very thing which prevents them from fitting in is actually a superpower. I think that is truly the greatest power of music.
图片 ©️ Lag
采访来源：Payful Magzine / Lag: Beograd VS Berlin + The issues with social media
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